Dear zPeti part 3
 

Hello zPeti, it's me again, your lovable customer (you do know what a customer is right?) who are keen to hear more about what is going on with the product you are offering called Planetarion.

In regards so that everyone can recap on the entire previous discussions going here I also link to the previous discussions namely: http://pirate.planetarion.com/showthread.php?t=197772 First Dear zPeti thread

http://pirate.planetarion.com/showthread.php?t=197776 His first update

http://pirate.planetarion.com/showthread.php?t=198461 the second Dear zPeti thread

http://pirate.planetarion.com/showthread.php?t=198471 his second response.

In this thread I like to point out a few things I am still waiting for after his second response.

I am wondering if you guys have difference calendars in Hungary compared to the Gregorian calender, as it seems to me that a few weeks from January 18th would put is in the middle of or early February, while we are now in May, and we've yet to hear anything from you in regards to what is going on with the new game. Maybe an update is in order?

I've also followed your blog with great enthusiasm which to my knowledge have not been updated since February 10th, but however, i was happy enough to read this wonderful interview with you in Entrepreneurship Interviews which can be read here: http://www.entrepreneurship-intervie...in-full-swing/ and been paying attention to your twitter account which can be found here: http://twitter.com/zpeti

All of these places, and unfortunately, I have found little or no new information about the new Planetarion game you are making.


So I guess I can take from this that your attention towards Planetarion has been like nill of late, and with the lack of updates, it seems to stay that way for a long time to come.

We have neither have heard or seen anything to any other news in regards to this game whom many of us feel have been greatly understaffed and under prioritized and was wondering if you had any plans to rectify this or to maybe let Planetarion go, so that some other people with a larger interest in renewing the game be given the opportunity to buy the game.

I want to urge you zPeti to strongly consider giving the game to someone who actually cares, and who wants to make a change with the game, so that Planetarion can get the revamp and relaunch it so desperately need.

At present I am strongly considering asking all players to stop purchasing credits for the game most likely this coming round or the next one.The game is more or less playable as a free game now. So I am going to urge all the alliances to tell their players to stop paying for credits. Why should we invest our money as customers into this product of yours when you so blatantly ignore us as your paying customers.

Please understand zPeti, that I am not doing this because I have something against you, I am doing this to make you aware that we as players do not like to feel like a milking-cow for some small businessman who cares jack shit about the game.

Looking forward to your response!
Sincerely regards

Kargool

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Speaking about what he did to achieve these fantastic results, Pete Zaborszky said “Most websites do not think about the customer. Many website owners tend to be lazy, and do not give their assets the attention they need. Just by working hard, and thinking about the customer, I was able to dramatically improve results. Similar to Dragon’s Den star Theo Paphitis and Ryman’s, just by optimising operations and considering what customers want, a business can be turned around.”
END QUOTE

I am not sure what to say...

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

"Peter believes he can achieve profits of £100,000 next year, without any additional financing."

I am impressed, financially speaking. Also glad that there will be plenty of money to invest in an improved PA!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Hi zZzPeti!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

i think it is clear from the player numbers that this game is struggling and unless something changes, may well dissapear.

all the people who volunteer for PA and do, imo, great work for free have my upmost respect. appoco sometimes gets a lot of crap but he keeps this game running as best he can with the resources given.

unless PA changes and progresses soon it will disappear (not rumour, truth).

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I think Appocomaster should consider resigning. It would force zPeti to actually start caring about his milkingcow so that we could get some movement in it. At the moment I feel PA is a bit like a comapatient on lifesupport. The lifesupport keeps it alive, but just barely, and the iron lung is about to collapse.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

This is nothing new, nor particularly shocking to anyone who has actually paid attention the last, oh, I don't know, 4 years?

Appoco does what he can, but there's only so much you can do without money.

As for the good old "PA is dying!" sentiment, it's been this way for years and assuming no one pulls the plug, it'll continue like this for years more. Unless something changes for the worse, we'll see round 50 with more than 500 planets.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

its not a sentiment its a fear mz.

500 planets is about 10 times too few as well..not really worth raving about

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

The only way zPeti will listen is if we start a movement to not paying for a round. PA-Team have no concept of what customer meens.

When i said CT would not be buying credits next round I got this reply:

[12:46] <@Cin[Away]> considering the amount of credits players in your alliance most likely has "left over", by not upgrading they don't do much of an impact, as they already paid for most so
[12:48] <+gm|away> every planet in ct is upgraded
[12:54] <+gm|away> call it blackmail if you want, just remember we are customers, if we dont like something we dont need to buy it
[13:01] <@Ace> it also means you dont decide for the customers under your alliance if they want to pay or not as they are the customer

Since I upgrade most of the CT members I should know how much it would cost PA and thier feelings on it.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

You'd think after so long on pateam cin's awareness of customer service would have made it above the realm of "truly woeful" into something like "usually disappointing". I guess not though.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I think that is an excellent initative gm, and I hope that a lot of other alliances follow that same sentiment.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

im afraid dispair has set in too hard with the other alliances, this round they didnt even have the energy to fight. except puss and titos

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

haha, some of those quotes / logs made me laugh:D

I for one will not be purchasing any credits next round(s)

And Cin, most people I know use their creds each round. If they haev spare creds, someone else will get them. I dont think its very common that people have spare creds from the past round. Not that it ****ing matters you idiot.
<3

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

People pay for credits?

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Dear zPeti: SUCK A D

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

As noble as this sounds, you really think a community like PA can pull it off? Some alliance HC's rather applaud the lack of opposition or the lack of worthy contestors.

Then again, timing is perfect I guess, as signups for a summer round and mostly less then usual, not?

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

We manage to do teamups on alliances 5v1, surely we can manage to pull off a refusal to buy credits, however, zPeti will have get time to produce a response to my thread before I will start to talk to people about boycott.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Well, I hope they give you a satisfying answer or otherwise that you succeed in your actions.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I would be happy to lend my and my alliances support to your boycott Kargool!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

How much would it cost to make the game as an apple/android app so that it if free for everyone with the right phones to download? Sureoy we have enough talented programmers and thinkers around that could help with this project and then the game we love could be seen and used by millions...

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

EvE is quite good.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I second that :)

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

if PA-Team or zPeti cant even inform the comunity on whats happening with signups we may as well just boycott now.

They cba to end the round properly, now they cba to start a round properly!

They could of at least put a notification up and changed the round number on the signup page.

I think we deserve some action from zPeti.

zPeti get off your arse and show us you care about PA!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

/me cries for pa

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

i call for a free round !!!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

A free round?! But that may eat into his £100,000 profit for the year!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I am not sure how much information has been disclosed by PA Team yet, but from next round Planetarion will have a full passport system ready that will replace the current portal.

Yes, this is much later than players would have liked, but I've begun investing in the development of the game.

And yes, I know what the response will be, this is not enough and why isn't the actual game changing. I am working on how to achieve this too, but the passport system seemed like a good start.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Omg, another promise? You can't take a promise to the bank, zZzPeti!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Hi zPeti, would you care to comment on the quote you gave in your interview?

Have you changed your attitude in regards to this?

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Who gives a shit about a passport system?

Thats something which should have been incorporated years ago anyway, and not something anyone really care about :(

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Better late than never, though.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Just win another round and you can have a small trophy in your passport wish!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

But PA is free. People don't pay for the ridiculous ingame bonus they receive but because they want to support the game.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Ask anyone of PATeam. The coding is done, just needs to be integrated now.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I wouldn't mind a delay on r37 start then to give you the short time needed to just integrate it...

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

zPeti who gives a fck about passport!

there is a lot you can change to improve PA that doesnt require coding. problem is pa-team and you do not play the game so you are completely out of touch with the game.

appoco is being left to all the comunity facing part of pa and its obvious that he doesnt have time for it.

random at 25+, alliance limits, targeting, donations.... all bs settings that can be fixed quickly if someone cared.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Except that half of those things aren't wrong in the opinion of other people.....

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

well..
gal sizes at 25, would be better going all random this round with gals starting at 8 in size.

alliance limits are just retarded, may as well get rid of both limits altogether than have this setup.

targeting, while some people like single targeting, most dont. but we should have it so if your ship doesnt target T1 then T2 should be say 20% of targeting everything. if your going to war you dont just stand and watch if you have the wrong gun.

dontations, some people might like it but being able to have donation whores in private galaxys is retarded.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

While I agree that one might probably do some changes to Plantetarion as it is today GM, what we do need is to scratch the current game and start new. The game we got today holds no real ability to attract or intrest players due to its rather large timeconsuming effort it takes to play.

This game is not what it was, and needs to be changed into Planetarion 2.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I always love it when stuff like this happends..

"WTF, why arnt you posting on here anymore zPeti.. cmon post and tell us whats going on"

"we've been working on a passport system and it will be ready for next round"

"FU zPeti", "Your the worst owner ever zPeti", "we dont care about anything your doing", "i want things fixed that i dont like, even though other people and the PA Team like them", "random trolling".

Admins and Owners very rarely post on forums in alot of games, mainly due to it being pointless. You dont get constructive critisism or anything of real value from doing so, you just open yourself up to abuse; This thread is a prime example of that If you want more communication, then learn to communicate yourself without flaming.. If you feel something is wrong, then explain why its wrong not just random flaming about the subject.

Whenever a owner posts on a forum, it becomes an open invitation for everyone who has a problem with something in the game to flame them with little/no actual relevent information. Lets take gm's flame post in this thread, its worth to note that gm is HC of CT and not just a random person:

'who gives a fck about passport', alot of people its been requested for ages now.
'there is alot you can change to improve PA that doesnt require coding', then discuss these changes with the PA Team.
'random at 25+, alliance limits, targetting, donations'.. these are all things YOU dislike about the game and arnt what the community or game needs to change. Also, this is your chance to talk in a thread where you know the owner is reading and instead of making points with evidence or arguments for changing these things.. you just flame? I think all those points you listed have been discussed in length in threads on these forums, you could of just linked to those threads (but then, in those threads theres actually counter-arguments to your flame).

As for a passport system, its a thing the community has wanted for a while and if developed properly will allow for more features to be added to the game. They can add in a proper tutorial system for new signups which older accounts wont have or need, they can restrict or slowly introduce features to new accounts with proper explanations while allowing older signups to carry on as usual, they can add in incentives and other bonuses for long time players which would also add in an additional consequence to cheating as they'd lose these incentives/bonuses, they can add in a better history and stats page, It will make signups alot easier when a new round starts and will lower the risk of what happend this round, It will allow the PA team to send polls and questions to new accounts to get there feedback (as thats usually they hard to do). A passport system allows for alot of things and isnt just a 'easier signup'.

Yes, its not a major gameplay change but then again.. zPeti doesnt play nor does he have enough knowledge of the game to know which gameplay changes are good or bad; Thats the PA Team's job not zPetis.

If you want gameplay changes, then you have to make a thread or document explaining the gameplay change you want implemented and then you/the community has to convince the PA Team that this is a good change that the PA Team should take the time to implement. zPeti doesnt really come into much, as im fairly sure Appocomaster could say any gameplay change to zPeti and zPeti would agree, Appocomaster/PA Team have basically free reign on gameplay changes, its just a case of them having to manage there time to implement the changes they want (and as they arnt paid, they dont have that much free time).

All i'd say to zPeti is that you've bought a game which is near its last-legs, there is nothing you can really do to keep the community happy. Hell, you cant even have 1-2 rounds with single targetting stats without people threatening to quit. This game is surviving through its old community, which will slowly decline. This old community, which is constantly asking for more changes and drastic gameplay changes 'to keep the game fresh' is also the same community which is resistant to almost any gameplay change. One of the major blocks in PA's development is that it isnt attractive to casual players and everyone agree's on this but any change to make it more casual friendly is always greeted by harsh critisism from the community as its 'dumbing down' the game in there eyes. PA Team doesnt want to implement major gameplay changes as it risks making the old community leave the game quicker than they would of originally and the community which is constantly calling for gameplay changes actually resists any change (considering any gameplay change would and should be aimed at making the game more friendly to casuals, noobs, and new signups).

All i'd suggest you do in the future, is be the one who makes the announcements on this forum. Make an announcement at the end of each round, stating whats coming in the new round and then make an announcement mid-round about whats currently being worked on for the new round (even if its minor tweaks) or how the development of major things are going and what round we should expect them. Do not post anything other than that, as you'll just encourage more trolling, flaming and rage posts. Like this passport system, you shouldnt of announced it in a thread which was posted just to flame and try and force a responce from you as nomatter what you announced, it would of been greeted with flaming. As far as finances goes and the future of this game, you should be aiming to break-even on your investment and then consider selling the game on before it collapses, hopefully to Spinner or someone who actually knows the game and has the time to code changes themselves rather than relying on free-help from the community (which dont really have the time to do it).

I cant stress this enough, Dont respond to flame threads or flame posts directly petitioning or calling for your attention. Talk to the community through announcements and maybe the EORC ceremony, doing anything else will just be inviting trolling. Make your announcements in the 'announcement' section of the forum where people cannot directly respond in the thread to flame. You should also be telling moderators to delete posts like Kennys which are 100% flame and posts like Wishmasters below which are directly advertising another game.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Honestly, I agree with Light here. People have been requesting a passport system for a long time, and while it's taken a long time, late is better than never. I also think this is an important part of keeping existing players and making old players return. There is still a lot of work to do, but this is definately a step in the right direction.

Also, thanks for replying to this thread zPeti. It's nice to see that you are atleast around and paying attention. While I do agree that I am a bit dissapointed by the pace the game is developing it, this is definately a step up from Jolt.

Also gm, I think a majority of people I talk to disagrees with pretty much everything you said (except maybe removing alliance limits), so I'm pretty sure you saying that "most people this" or "some people that" is something you are totally pulling out of your ass.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

In regards to Kennys comment

This shit game got 200k players from FB
I just signed up and am having fun reading through their "AD" atm, much like ours used to be back in the days!

there still IS a market for Browser spaceship stragey games, people just dont know about PA.
PA used to be for casual and hardcore gamers back in the days, when there were actually enough players.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

In regards to Light's edit to her post citing that Wishmaster was advertising another game, I'm going to have to (dis)respectfully disagree.

I do believe that Wishmaster was using another browser based webgame as a point of comparisson to highlight the potential that PA still has as a browser game. Anyone could just go making up facts and figures, but what WM has just done has demonstrated, by way of an example (read: 'evidence'), is highlighted the current unreached potential that PA still has.

That is all.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Light, I dont want to move from pa to another game, cause this other game looks shit in comparison.

BUT you can learn from looking at other successful similar games.
Maybe we wouldnt get 200k players ( cause this game is way too casual and doesnt have "rounds" and just involves too much random shit ) but it is probably the only way PA can survive longterm.

Kenny pretty much said the same as me, I just felt I had to point it out also!

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

Again, this is sorta my point. You're posting in this thread and linked to a game with 200k players using it as an example of what to do and that the sueccessful game model for Planetarion should be to make the game alot more casual, maybe delete the round system, and involve more randomness? yet the second anything gets announced that makes the game slightly more casual or anything near that game, im 100% certain there would be a post on this forum from you, saying you're not playing next round if the changes go ahead.

Hell, you've "stopped playing" PA twice now, just by the PA Team using ST stats which alot of players liked as it evens the playing field and allows them to hit the top planets (while the top planets tend to hate the stats as they cant just fortress up). If there was actually any proper changes to even the playing field and take out 'activity' as the main component in success, you'd might actually follow through with your idle threats! :p

Its a no win situation for zPeti. The game needs to change and the community wants change but the community is resistant to any change thats actually needed.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I know people have been asking for a passport system for a long time but im not fully aware of how it will fix all of the problems.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

It's not meant to fix all the problems, it's meant to be a step towards fixing one of them. They have to start somewhere. Maybe their prioritizing could be better, but atleast this is a start and a step in the right direction.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

I m not sure if you are just dumb or just not getting it. I ll go for the dumb one since I know you <3

Like I said, I DONT LIKE THAT OTHER GAME cause its too casual. I then say that I still think theres a market for PA without making it too casual. People just need to know that we are here. Need to learn the basics.

Light, do you think people should spend their time doing shit they dont like?

Hence why I wouldnt play PA if it got shit casual and why I said I wont play ST rounds cause I just dont like it, I dont have fun while playing. It has NOTHING to do with fortressing, but I dont think ST / MT discussion should be had here.

and stopped playing twice? I havent stopped playing, Ijust said I wont play that round. I havent quit PA.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

what benifits does passport provide? I dont use it for any other websites.

priority i would of thought would be the game.

Re: Dear zPeti part 3
 

First of all, I want to make it clear that I am not really that bothered about the game changes and if we have multi targetting or if a ship is called the pink fluffy bunny or whatever, that is something that solves itself when we got the people dedicated to making changes and having the right amount of time for the game will bother and care about.

My initial gripe, and it has been for all along is a total lack of communication, it is letting the game be handled in a most careless way because the people put in charge do so on a squarely volunteer basis and do not have the time to put aside for coding a new game (which I think is the way forward.)

Now I do disagree to some extent with Light's comment that owners and creators of a game should not interact with the community playing the game. As an example; Football Manager which holds a large community alive, and has people from SI communicating and taking part in discussions about the game. Now everyone does not like football, but you cannot say that their approach to the community that plays their game is a waste of time. Heck, even I have emails from some of the creators, and they got back to me only hours after posting things on their messageboards. How many copies of their game do they sell EVERY year? I wonder..

The trolls you ignore, or worst case moderate, the actual good ideas you take onboard, you shape it to fit the idea you have for your game, and you make your game better.

However I do completely agree with Light on one thing. (Yes, pigs does fly in a snowy blizzard in hell) zPeti should make announcments fairly regulary, and to be around for EORC and maybe a CH every now and then at LEAST to show that he actually is doing something. Or else people WILL feel left out and left in the dark. Information is key to any community, and that is why the people behind the game need to show their face now and then. Even if it would be to just say: "Hey guys, we dont have any news to announce, but work on things are moving along nicely."