Housing Law, Anyone?
 

I have recently left uni and therefore have moved out of my student accomidation. I had lived there for two years. I have not had my bond back yet (which is another matter) but some of my hosuemates have and have been charged for cleaning the house. I am pretty sure it was cleaned after I left.

I have two questions:

1) Can he charge us for general cleaning of the house before the new tennants move it? I'm not talking about broken windows or anything, more like an unemptied freezer and unhoovered carpets?

2) Is he required by law to have the house properly cleaned before he lets it to new people?

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

1) That depends on the terms of your lease
2) he's required by statute to make sure any of his properties are safe and fit for human habitation - that doesn't necessarilly mean that he has to polish the ceilings

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

regarding
1) if it was listed in the lease that you may be charged for general cleaning after you leave then yes
2) no-one letting property is required to have house properly cleaned before letting but who wants to let a dirty house , its good buisness sense to have it cleaned


please note these answers are based on commen sense and not legal definitions

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

There will almost always be something in the lease stating that the condition of the house must be the same when you move out as when you move in, or something like that.

You should always do an itinerary before you move in and just before you move out so you can check the house with the landlord and agree the condition of everything.

Landlords are famous for trying to get every last penny they can out of the tenants once they have left. I've argued on my ex's behalf to her landlord to get most of her bond back.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

sadly this is a case of read the small print b4 u sign anything :-(

take heed anyone reading this - it applies to any contract, read it .. demand to be able to read it b4 u sign, if they get shirty about that or wont give u more than a day to do so, theres something in there.

in your case , the question is , what kind of condition did you leave the place in ? ideally it should be the same way that u left it, that includes emptying the fridge and making sure its clean and if you do find any problems take 2 photos, send 1 in a letter to your landlaord immediately and one to yourself .. and dont open it, the post mark .. if it comes down to legal with lawyers and stuff is legally binding .

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

He can do what he likes to return the property to its original state before you moved in so if you knock holes in the wall it must be rectified and likewise if you stain his white carpet red with wine. He can replace the carpet. However ordinarily stated in your lease will be general wear and tear. HOwever not hoovering the carpet when you leave is a shorefire way to not get your deposit returned as it shows your lack of interest for the general upkeep and maintenance of the property

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Your agreement wills say something like "fair wear and tear aside". The longer you have occupied the property, the more of an argument you will have that damage, if any to the furnishings was fair, considering the period.

No.

However i can almost certainly guaruntee that there are certain aspects of the law that he has failed to serve his obligations towards.

For example, if there were any gas appliances on the site, or a gas meter he IS required by law to issue you with a CP12 CORGI registered Landlords Gas Safety Record under the 1998 Gas Safety Regulations act.
If he hasnt done this then you can report him to CORGI, who will defer the case to the HSE (http://www.hse.gov.uk/prosecutions/).
The upshot of this is that he will have to cease trading as a business while he is investigated.

Perhaps with this sort of information he will be more willing to pay your deposit in full...

Its advisable imo to take photos of a property when you move in and out, ive started doing this and, whilst i havent had to use them yet (so i dont know if they stand from a legal viewpoint), they would certainly act well as a deterrent.

Hope this helps!

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Excellent idea!

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

I'm a landlord and while I can expect to have some reasonable wear and tear while tenants are in a property, I also expect teh place to be cleaned to a standard near to where it was prior to the beginningof the lease.

The standard ARLA rental agreement states:

The last time I had tenants change, the previous ones had painted several walls in a different colour to the existing. They paid for the walls to be re-painted, I didn't have to get heavy-handed, I just explained that it wasn't as it was at the beginning of the lease, and I would have to paint before the new tenants moved in.
They didn't clean the place brilliantly, but it was good enough. I paid for the carpets to be cleaned before the new tenants moved in.

Essentially, if you'd have made an effort, by emptying the freezer and doing a quick clean, it shows the landlord you've tried, if you don't bother, don't expect to get your deposit back and don't expect to have much in teh ways of any grounds to dispute at leats a partial retention of it if you can't be arsed to clean.

Furious has good points, if it's a shithole when you move in, or paint is discoloured, etc, make sure you record that at the beginning, otherwise it will be you paying for it at the end.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

As i understand it, the terms quoted above would only be applicable if the landlord has gone through ARLA?

Or is it a requirement that the ARLA agreement must form the basis of any landlords contract.

Im just thinking that theres every chance that All Systems Go would have recieved a more personalised (i.e. scrawled on the back of a beer mat) contractual arrangement if we're talking student accomodation.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

True. If the agreement is on the back of a beer mat, problems will undoubtedly ensue. If the landlord hasn't stated what he wants and the tenant hasn't stated what he is willing to do, then there is no agreement and much shouting will undoubtedly result.
Plus, since the landlord has your deposit, I'd be sure to find out what I need to do to get it back.

Basically, if the house needed cleaning (unemptied freezer and un-hoovered floors) ASG should expect to have deductions. It depends how much those deductions are...

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Best. Advice. Ever.

Blackmailing your dirty landlord. :devil:

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

hmmm...at the end of the day the worst case scenario i would imagine would be obtaining an itemised list, with reciepts of what he has spent the deposit on.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

It's shit like this that always has me
a) Making sure I clean the damn flat properly
b) Making sure I'm there for the final inventory check to argue the toss over any issues that arise

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Bah, come back when your landlord fails to pay his mortgage so you get repossession notices through the door (and a possession order which is about to expire). Then you can talk about shit landlords. :(

Anyway, the answer has been given several times already but yeah he's probably within his rights if the tenancy agreement is like most of the shorthold tenancy agreements I've seen.

It's fairly logical that you should ensure the property is in the same condition when you move out. But deposit related faggotry is why a lot of people just don't bother paying their last months rent.

While this is true I'm not sure how you'd practically threaten him with it. It would also engender more bad will which you don't really need from someone you may be relying on for a reference in the future.

Besides, most landlords these days do actually do a CP12 check on relet because letting agents (reputable ones that is) are reluctant to let without seeing one. So the upshot is that for tenancies lasting 6 or 12 months there is usually a valid CP12 in place. For tenancies that last longer then 12 months then it's dodgier (our last one was 15 months ago for instance) and it's probably only councils / local authorities which do this religiously.

Finally : When you move into any new accomodation take date-stamped photographs to record it's condition. If nothing else, it'll remind you how clean the place needs to be when you're trying to clean it up.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

The onus is entirely on the landlord.

ofc this is only one angle you could use, there may not be a need to get this aggressive.

I would think he would need to be vetted to appear on some sort of a uni register to be able to offer his services to uni students. Perhaps there is some way of getting the uni involved?

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

basically, the up shot is that you are going to lose your deposit, its happened to the best of us mate :(

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

I'm not sure I was clear. My question was, let's imagine that ASG's landlord hasn't carried out a service or supplied the correct documentation. How is ASG to use that? Is he to phone up the landlord and say; "Hi, you know that money you owe me? I'm going to grass on you to the HSE if you don't give it to me" then I'm not sure that is going to help matters much.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

the landlord couldnt give a shit about the deposit either way he just has fun trying to keep it so he can buy a few beers at the pub. Eitherway after a one year lease the place will be repainted and refurbished, so why not get the previous tenant to pay for it. I always try to. Its a bit harder in the uk nowe though as all deposits must be held with tony blair or your letting agency rather than the landlord. But its still fun to try refute returning a deposit

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Im sure in his time ASG has learnt a thing or two about the subtle approach.
Im not sure what other sort of reply you're expecting here...a word-by-word account of what must be said to the landlord?

As for the general idea not helping much...ASG is several hundred pounds out of pocket. How could it get worse?

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Why doesn't ASG get off his fat arse and find out how much the others got charged, rather than expect to lose it all.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

No, just a general idea of what you'd do in the circumstances.
As I've already mentioned, he may require a reference from this fellow. Threatening the guy (especially if it proves ineffective) isn't really going to help in that regard.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

Most of the leases I have signed stated that the dwelling must be cleaned or the deposit will be used towards cleaning the place before what is left is returned. The leases also state the place is rented "as is" and that no modifications/repairs can be done without prior approval or consent.

If you happen to still owe some for the last month usually it is difficult to prove that further money is needed for cleaning.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

How would that conversation go!

"Hi, remember that house i lived in, where you stole several hundred pounds off me as landlord....well can you recommend me?!"

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

It's not a conversatoin he'd have. On the form for any new let he'd have to fill out where he's previously lived. The letting agent will then contact them. He can of course lie (I've had to do this) but then when they do a credit check (usually they do) it may reveal inconsistencies in your address record (e.g. your credit check showed you lived x, you say you've lived y). That can then cause problems with future lets.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

I don't expect to lose it all. I expect to get it back, eventually.

One of my housemates got £140 back and another got £180 (which I found out last night). the bond was about £200. this thread is more about knowing what I can be charged for (and what I can't), when I get it back.

Re: Housing Law, Anyone?
 

1. Yes - you should have emptied the fridge and hoovered the carpets. Always make sure you leave a place in a better state as when u first moved in, and have pictures from when you first moved in. That prevents a lot of hassle.

2. Yes, and be glad of that. You wouldn't want to move into a roach infested house where food is still rotting in the fridge from previous inhabitants either :)